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news and politics » 2016 US elections

Carpetsmoker's avatar
3 years ago
r1, link
Carpetsmoker
Martin
Anyone following this?

On one hand, you have the GOP clown car; it was funny at first, now it's getting a bit scary as each candidate seems to be in a race to be the silliest most disconnected-from-reality candidate yet. The only people who are on a vague acquaintance with reality have no change of wining :-/

On the elephant side we have only two real contestants: Bernie and Hillary. Plenty of people across the political spectrum dislike (and even hate) Hillary for one reason or another, and I highly doubt Bernie's electability in the race for presidency (he identifies as ... socialist! *gasp!* *shock!* *horror!*)

To make matters worse, we have a Bush who stands a serious chance of winning the nomination (polls are not good, but I suspect that many people in the ballot box might "chicken out" and vote Bush instead of Trump or Carson), and Hillary who is almost guaranteed to win the nomination. That would mean there's a real chance that the office would be "Bush-Clinton-Bush-Obama-{Clinton,Bush}", which doesn't exactly make US democracy look healthy (to say the least).

I fear you people are fucked :-/
nny's avatar
3 years ago
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nny
M̮͈̣̙̰̝̃̿̎̍ͬa͉̭̥͓ț̘ͯ̈́t̬̻͖̰̞͎ͤ̇ ̈̚J̹͎̿̾ȏ̞̫͈y̭̺ͭc̦̹̟̦̭̫͊̿ͩeͥ̌̾̓ͨ
Go trump!
phi_'s avatar
3 years ago
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phi_
... and let the Earth be silent after ye.
Shrug. We're all fucked anyway, who cares who the captain is?
Carpetsmoker's avatar
3 years ago
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Carpetsmoker
Martin
You live in Texas, right? Doesn't that mean you're doubly fucked?
phi_'s avatar
3 years ago
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phi_
... and let the Earth be silent after ye.
Yeah, but maybe we'll actually secede and I'll get to experience some Mad Max style insanity before I'm taken away by secret police for seditious speech. That'd be cool.
nny's avatar
2 years ago
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nny
M̮͈̣̙̰̝̃̿̎̍ͬa͉̭̥͓ț̘ͯ̈́t̬̻͖̰̞͎ͤ̇ ̈̚J̹͎̿̾ȏ̞̫͈y̭̺ͭc̦̹̟̦̭̫͊̿ͩeͥ̌̾̓ͨ
worse comes to worst the texans just go back to being their own ridiculous nation.
Carpetsmoker's avatar
2 years ago
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Carpetsmoker
Martin
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/n … us-already
lucas's avatar
2 years ago
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lucas
i ❤ demo
my opinions on it:

hillary has experience and a pragmatic view, but she's got a business-as-usual view and lacks trustworthiness. (polls agree with my view on these points.) remember that she lagged obama in even supporting gay marriage--what does it even mean that she's a woman? she's unwilling to step forward for what is right. regardless, i'd like to have a female president. so i think the only reason to vote for her is because she's a woman and has experience.

bernie is more idealistic and wants to do some things i agree with (increase spending on health care and education), but his plan to do so doesn't make any sense (it's gracious to even call it a plan). he lacks experience, but seems more trustworthy than hillary, rejecting large donations and PAC support. because the GOP are a bunch of infantile obstructionists who would probably cooperate even less with socialist bernie than with a moderate black man, bernie and the GOP together would lead the country down a dangerous road of perpetual defaults and shutdowns.

trump is probably just trying to make a tv show. if he were to become president-elect, he would turn the presidency into a reality tv show. or maybe he'd address the populace, "wow, you are all fools," and ride into the sunset.

ted cruz is scarier than trump, because he's the real deal. he is the embodiment of what's wrong with our country (and the GOP).

chris christie is a good guy with an anger management problem.

carson doesn't know anything about economics. frightening.

rubio or kusich are probably ok GOP choices?
Carpetsmoker's avatar
2 years ago
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Carpetsmoker
Martin
I dislike Hillary on account of being Bill's wife. I mean, after papa and son Bush, there's now the Clintons? It doesn't sound like a healthy democracy to me. More on the issue, I'm greatly disappointed by the US' foreign policy. Basically, the Bush-era crap continued, if not intensified. That shit with drones? It's possibly even worse than Bush's crimes if you ask me, and Clinton was right at the centre of that. And all the GOP can do is scream about her fucking emails and Benghazi like a bunch of children with a mental handicap (distracting from the real problems).

Also, this is why I like Sanders as a person: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGv2SPB8pNU

> he [Bernie] lacks experience

And other people do have experience at being the US president?

The whole "experience" thing sounds like a red herring to me, just like it did in 2008 against Obama.

> because the GOP are a bunch of infantile obstructionists who would probably cooperate even less with socialist bernie than with a moderate black man, bernie and the GOP together would lead the country down a dangerous road of perpetual defaults and shutdowns.

This is indeed also my largest concern with Bernie. Which is actually really pathetic if you think about it. The GOP turned into a bunch of whiny manchildren insistent on getting their way and screaming like four year olds if they don't. Sure, the democrats aren't perfect or free from blame here, but nowhere near as bad as the GOP.

> trump is probably just trying to make a tv show. if he were to become president-elect, he would turn the presidency into a reality tv show. or maybe he'd address the populace, "wow, you are all fools," and ride into the sunset.

I call him Donald Beeblebrox Trump. If you know anything about the hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy you should know why, because the only thing missing is a second head.
phi_'s avatar
2 years ago
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phi_
... and let the Earth be silent after ye.
GOP is going to wither away and die. All the right wing nuts have gone libertarian. Which makes me laugh because they still seem to support the death penalty and police officers.

The Dems are just business as usual imperialists like the GOP, they just put a nicer face on it.

Let the country go with them, as far as I'm concerned.
phi_'s avatar
2 years ago
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phi_
... and let the Earth be silent after ye.
Enough said
lucas's avatar
2 years ago
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lucas
i ❤ demo
man that's a great article.
phi_'s avatar
2 years ago
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phi_
... and let the Earth be silent after ye.
Matt Taibbi is amazing at what he does.
Carpetsmoker's avatar
2 years ago
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Carpetsmoker
Martin
So Donald Trump got nominated...

I'm not sure whether to laugh or to be scared... Probably both ....
lucas's avatar
2 years ago
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lucas
i ❤ demo
looks like he's locked up a loss. looking forward to the debate in 75 minutes.
nestor's avatar
2 years ago
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nestor
nestor
what the fuck guys.
phi_'s avatar
2 years ago
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phi_
... and let the Earth be silent after ye.
He's the president we earned.

...... I wish Biden would have become president. That would have been the funniest 4 years ever.
lucas's avatar
2 years ago
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lucas
i ❤ demo
i was grief-stricken on wednesday. so disappointed with my fellow americans.

yeah, i really wish biden would have run, too. he would have made a great president. and he may have won.
Carpetsmoker's avatar
2 years ago
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Carpetsmoker
Martin
I've literally felt terrible since the news; especially since the Dutch equivalent of Trump (Wilders/PVV) is leading in the polls for the March 2017 elections... Oh, and on a number of positions Wilders is considerably more extreme than Trump :-/
nestor's avatar
2 years ago
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nestor
nestor
I am also really fucked up since then. I'm in awe of everyone around me who has accepted this.
Carpetsmoker's avatar
2 years ago
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Carpetsmoker
Martin
I think a lot of people are thinking "oh, well, surly it can't be *that* bad!"

And perhaps it won't be – although I doubt it – but the important thing is not so much how Trump's four years (or, good heavens, eight years!) will go down *exactly*, it's that it sets a precedent, it shifts what is considered "normal", and I do not like the "new normal". This is a new normal that is disdainful of facts and reality and brags about it. It is a new normal that grossly violates both Christian and humanist (and by extension America's) basic values when they are inconvenient. It is a new normal that doesn't want to discus on how to live together in spite of differences in opinion, but only wants to rule.

So even if Trump doesn't fuck things up as gigantically as I fear, what will this mean for the world in 10 years? 20 years? 30 years?

I already disliked the current political and democratic system, but I like it even less now. It's time for a new democracy, because this shit is just ridiculous.
lucas's avatar
2 years ago
r3, link
lucas
i ❤ demo
yeah, i felt like my heart was broken on wednesday. i was so upset that i couldn't work at all

yes, i think it will be bad:
-- it validates the gop's infantile obstruction of obama's rightful nomination of a supreme court justice. more scotus justices will likely retire during trump's term. women in the united states may very well lose the right to abortion.
-- the mixing of trump business and politics will be a huge mess.
-- and a million other things

frankly, it's disgusting how americans united around hate and bigotry.

i started a couple related threads, hoping for a little bit of discussion!
-- fake news
-- trump scotland wall

my girlfriend of ~1.5 years and i broke up recently, so i might be checking ttf a bit more than usual.
Carpetsmoker's avatar
2 years ago
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Carpetsmoker
Martin
> frankly, it's disgusting how americans united around hate and bigotry.

Except that they didn't really, did they? Clinton won the popular vote by a fairly comfortable margin, and in the end, only about 25% of the US population voted for Trump. Of that 25% a sizeable number probably didn't really vote "for" Trump, but rather "against" Clinton, as they felt that Clinton was the "greater evil". That's a ludicrous position for various reasons if you ask me, but it does give some hope for the future...

Speaking of the popular vote, it looks like Trump is disputing that already: http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2016/1 … ally-tweet

The man just can't bear it to be seen to "lose" even one iota...